Archive for the I John Category

Apostasy

Posted in Apostasy, Assurance, Guy Prentiss Waters, I John, Perseverance with tags , , on October 17, 2007 by Black&TanInTheAM

Do not love the world nor the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the boastful pride of life, is not from the Father, but is from the world. The world is passing away, and also its lusts; but the one who does the will of God lives forever.

The world is passing away, and its lusts; but the one who does the will of God lives forever. Children, it is the last hour; and just as you heard that antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have appeared; from this we know that it is the last hour. They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have remained with us; but so that it would be shown that they all are not of us. But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you all know. I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it, and because no lie is of the truth.

Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son. Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also.

As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father. This is the promise which He Himself made to us: eternal life. These things I have written to you concerning those who are trying to deceive you.

As for you, the anointing which you received from Him abides in you, and you have no need for anyone to teach you; but as His anointing teaches you about all things, and is true and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you abide in Him. Now, little children, abide in Him, so that when He appears, we may have confidence and not shrink away from Him in shame at His coming. If you know that He is righteous, you know that everyone also who practices righteousness is born of Him.

Here is the passage from I John where the proof text for perseverance of the saints appears.  GP Waters’ use of this text is to defend his view of perseverance.  He says that the ones who turned away from John in his ministry turned away b/c they were never a part of the eternally decreed covenant people.  Does this necessarily follow?  Let us consider possible interpretations for this text.

The text above shows the context to be that of the last hours and the presence of the AC.  John says that there are certain persons who left his sphere of ministry.  Who are these “they” of whom John speaks?  Previously, John has been contrasting the children of God and the world.  He condemns the world to death and then mentions the AC.  John mentions this apostasy in regards to the presence of AC.  He then says that certain persons went out from him and his troupe.  His reason for their departure is that those ones never “belonged”.  Now, what does this mean?  (Now notice what John has not said as well as what he has.)  Here are the options:

A)   These ones were not truly saved otherwise they would not have left.

B)   These ones were much like those in John 6 who left b/c of difficult things.

I truly think these are the only options.  Both make assumptions about those who left. 

“A” makes the assumption that these ones had professed Christ, were baptised and appeared to be Christians.  This says more than the text does. 

“B” assumes only that the reasons for leaving were personal difficulties (i.e. love of the world as is John’s previous warning).  There is no need to appeal to the decree or of eternal salvation here. 

Now, to be sure, both choices presuppose a doctrinal view.  It cannot be helped.  Both choices are interpreted according to the interpreter’s predisposition to the text.

GP Waters assumes these men have gone through a conversion experience and appear to be true branches but b/c they have left, they show they were never branches at all. 

The alternate view assumes only that these ones left the sphere of John’s ministry for love of the world.  That seems to be his point.  He says not to love the world for loving the world is hostility b4 God and then mentions certain men who left. The conclusion might be drawn that it was for love of cosmos rather than for God that these men left.